Introvert or Extrovert? (page 3) - CycleBlaze

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Introvert or Extrovert? (page 3)

Wayne EstesTo Andrea Brown

I can tell that my social skills have declined in the 18 years since I retired. When I had a job I was forced to regularly interact with others. Now I am alone far more often and simply get less practice interacting with other people. The pandemic (actual closures and burning bridges with various groups) accelerated the process.

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1 year ago
Andrea BrownTo Wayne Estes

That’s a really honest and important observation, Wayne. I see some of that in myself but I think I have weeded out some friendships pretty heavily, and I think that’s mostly because I have little patience anymore when all people have to offer is tales of woe or health issues. I have those! And I talk about them and am happy to listen to others’, up to a point. But if that’s the main topic over and over, I feel depleted and just prefer my own company and to do my own projects. My limited social bandwidth does not need to be spent that way. 

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1 year ago
Scott AndersonTo Andrea Brown

Thanks for the heads-up, Andrea.  We’ll try to be upbeat when we get together soon.  Who needs to hear about all the terrible woes Team Anderson gets subjected to anyway?

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1 year ago
Andrea BrownTo Scott Anderson

YOU'VE BEEN WARNED

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1 year ago
Susan CarpenterTo Mark Bingham

I readily admit to being on the E side of the introvert/extrovert continuum. Though I hate bars and partying with strangers, I am energized when in a crowd of people with a shared interest – being part of a demonstration for a cause I believe in, for example. I even like RAGBAI! This July I will ride 500 miles across Iowa in celebration of RAGBRAIs 50th year – it will be my 7th immersion into the sea of corn and cyclists. That said, I’m not normally a joiner, I don’t particularly like club rides, I abhor pace lines, and my day rides are usually alone, occasionally with a few friends/family.

 Despite my extrovert leanings, I have no problem being alone for extended periods of time. I’ve lived by myself for over thirty years and it doesn’t bother me to go several days without talking to anyone. I very much enjoy solo touring, but am always enthused to ride with friends for a week or two and have even enjoyed the occasional guided tour with complete strangers.

 My love of touring is experiencing both new places AND new people. More often than not, I embrace an opportunity to chat up random strangers, delighting in these ephemeral connections and rarely tiring of “the usual questions”. On occasion, these interactions have led to sustained relationships that now form part of my extended cycling family. This network has grown and strengthened since I’ve retired, and it definitely enriches my life.

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1 year ago
George HallTo Wayne Estes

[Author's aside ->  Wayne; I haven't intended to take so long to reply to your request to "Please say more about item #2, partners behaviors that you don't want to tolerate" - but I just recently finished 6 weeks of medical therapy that has depleted my energy and I am slowly getting back to normal (whatever that is).  So here we go.]

Hmmm.. in retrospect, maybe I shouldn't have mentioned other's behavior that I dislike - but I did, so now I'm in it and will elaborate per your request.   So, it falls in at least a few categories:

1.) On-The-Road Cycling Behavior. I always ride like I'm representing all of us in the cycling kingdom, especially so when I'm on tour.  With regards to other road users, I try to ride responsibly and politely.  I signal my turns when there's someone behind me who needs to know, I ride towards the right (usually about in the right wheel position of a motor vehicle, maybe more to the right if the road is wide enough) or on the shoulder if the shoulder is adequate, and I behave predictably at intersections.  I have a right to use the road and I exercise that right, but I'm not aggressive or militant about it.  When I need to stop for a quick break or photo, I make sure that there is no overtaking traffic and/or get far enough off the roadway so as to not interfere with others.  I think almost all of us ride in a similar manner, not just for our own safety, but also so as to interact positively with other road users (which also makes for a safer environment).   Most all the touring cyclists I have met ride in a similar safe and responsible manner - but not all. 

In my career there was a period when I worked as a Forensic Engineer - I did what is  called "accident reconstruction" in that I investigated motor vehicle collisions, mapped the scene, examined the vehicles, downloaded "black box" data, and used Newtonian physics to determine what happened (speed of the vehicles, point of the impact, what each vehicle did leading up to the collision, things that the jury would use to determine fault or guilt). I have some specialty training and certifications, and I have testified many times in court as an expert witness (the term "expert" is designated within the legal system - I'm not trying to sound boastful when I use it, but courts at the state and federal level have found me to be an expert and allowed me to present expert testimony - unlike lay witnesses, an expert's testimony can include his/her opinions, so expert testimony can be a powerful influence on juries).  I was involved as an expert in most every collision type imaginable; car-car, car-semi, car-atv, car-horse, car-pedestrian, and car-bicycle.  Over about a 20-year period I investigated most every serious car-bicycle collision in and near Oklahoma.   I've made presentations at conferences to police audiences on the dynamics of vehicle-bicycle collisions; I was an "invited speaker" to such conferences (meaning that they paid my expenses so they could hear what I had to say).  I've seen quite a few crash tests where a car is driven into a bicycle with a dummy suspended on it so we could understand the post-impact trajectory mechanics.  I've seen the results of numerous real-life motor vehicle versus bicyclist collisions and will spare us all the extremely gruesome details.  So I know a thing or 2 about cycling safety and collisions between motor vehicles and cyclists.  News flash; in a collision, the cyclist always loses regardless of who is at fault. 

So then, with that background, I'm trying to answer Wayne's question but finding it difficult to do so - mostly because I don't want to point fingers at individuals by listing specific egregious actions.  Each of us influences how the motoring public views all of us.  We all need to be cognizant that we aren't "special" road users and that "Share The Road" is a 2-way slogan that also applies to cyclists.  When you stop for a rest, get off the road far enough so as to not be a concern to approaching traffic.  Behave predictably at intersections.   Don't cycle past numerous motor vehicles stopped for a red light in the left-turn lane and then run that light while they are awaiting the light change.  In other words, don't cycle like an a-hole.   Everyone reading this is saying "of course not - no one rides like that!"  Unfortunately, some do, including touring cyclists.   When someone (cyclist or motorist) behaves in a manner that is outside of what we all expect, that increases the chance for a conflict with other road users.  In the world of forensic collision reconstruction, this is termed a "violation of driver's expectations" - we need to behave on the road in a safe and predictable manner, and this is what is expected by the other road users.  

I try to ride in a safe, responsible, and polite manner.  If others riding with me on tour don't do so, then the motoring public develops a bad opinion of all of us based on the actions of perhaps only 1 of us.  I need to feel confident that others with me on tour share the same values, and I have learned not to assume that they do.  

2.)  Behavior at Stores/Restaurants/etc.  On the Transam in 2015, I stopped at Scotty's Hell's Canyon store in the cool early morning for a hot chocolate break.  The store had a parking lot that was adjacent to a wooden deck with tables/chairs, and the deck led into the store.  I parked my bike beside the deck and went inside for my hot chocolate - when I tried to pay the owner said it was his treat.  I said "thanks" but that he didn't need to do that, I was just happy he was open in the early morning - he replied that he was giving me the hot chocolate because I had been considerate with how I parked my bike. He said that other cyclists would roll their bikes onto the deck and either lean them against the glass storefront (which he didn't like) or lean them against the picnic tables and take up space so that other's couldn't use the table. He told me it was especially bad when a group of cyclists arrived together because they would monopolize the entire deck. 

It was good to hear from the perspective of a store owner.  We cyclists (myself included) are often so worried about the security of our bikes that we forget that our actions in parking the bikes can be intrusive on other's rights.  There is a middle ground that I try to hit - park the bike in a secure location but in a way that doesn't interfere with others getting in/out of the store and doesn't take away from seating that others may want.   It helps that I have a click-stand; I can park the bike upright anywhere if needed, or I can lean it against a pole just by using the front brake-band.  I started to list an example of impolite behavior from my Northern Tier tour, but there's no need; the point is that we cyclists don't deserve to take more seating space than others just to park our bikes, and we shouldn't park somewhere that interferes with others getting in/out of the store/diner.  If a motorist parked in the parking lot and can't sit in the shade to eat because cyclists have taken up all the table space by leaning their bikes against the tables, then that motorist will not have a good impression of those cyclists - and that may impact how politely they later behave on the road when passing cyclists. 

3.) Behavior at Hotels.  I've ridden coast-to-coast twice, and have experienced only a couple of times when a hotel or motel was reluctant to let me bring my bike inside.  I'm grateful that they allow me to do so, and I try to be respectful with how I bring the bike in.  For starters, I always request a first-floor room so I can more easily get the bike to the room.  Wheeling the bike into the room isn't much of an issue at motels, but can definitely be one at hotels.  When arriving at the hotel, I park the bike outside and walk in.  During check-in I inquire about the closest outside door to my room, so I can wheel the bike in the shortest distance through the hotel.  During times that I have arrived during a rain, I retrieve a towel from my room and dry the bike and panniers before wheeling it inside so that I don't leave a water trail down the hall leading to my room.  In other words, I just use common sense and respect the fact that they are granting me an unusual privilege by allowing me to bring my bike inside.  My polite behavior will hopefully leave a good impression so that future cycle tourists will also be allowed to bring their bikes inside. 

I think most cyclists are considerate at hotels, but not all are.  Once in a rainstorm I arrived at the hotel ahead of my touring partner, parked my bike beneath the awning outside, and walked inside to check in.  While I was checking in my touring partner arrived, and despite the fact that I had parked outside he rolled his dripping-wet bike inside and proceeded to roll it through the lobby and down the hall to our room.  The clerk had given us a room near an outside door to make it easy for us to get the bikes inside, but my riding partner left a wet and slightly muddy trail through the lobby and hallway to our room.  His only thought was that he was wet and a bit cold and tired and he wasn't at all concerned that he was leaving an unnecessary mess for the hotel staff.  In contrast to his behavior, I rolled my bike outside to the door closest to our room and dried the bike best I could before bringing it in - but my polite and considerate behavior was overshadowed by his impolite/inconsiderate behavior.  In the future, will this hotel continue to allow cyclists to bring their bikes inside? 

4.) Compatible Goals - Why Are You Riding This Route?   This is somewhat related to cyclist behavior - before starting a tour with others, there really needs to be an understanding of everyone's goals.   This can avoid surprises or disappointment later. It's not that everyone has to have the same goals, it's just that those goals should be understood up front.  Are you riding coast-to-coast for the bragging rights of doing so, or are you doing it to experience small-town America?  (hey, those goals aren't incompatible) Do you want to follow the lesser-traveled and perhaps more scenic roads, or do you want to just beeline the shortest route between Point A and Point B each day?  Do you want to interact with other cyclists along the way or do you just want to push ahead?  Are you sure you are comfortable with the amount of camping planned for the tour?  We plan this tour to be 8 weeks long, how will you react if/when things go awry and we now need 9 weeks to complete it?   Is it important to you that you complete the entire tour on bicycle, or are you okay if a kind stranger transports you and the bike via pickup truck through some tough portion of the route?   What happens if you have a mechanical failure and get transported via pickup for 50 miles to the nearest bike shop - are you okay with missing that 50-mile section of the tour, or will you return to that point once the bike is repaired?   What happens if there's a several-mile construction zone that can't be crossed via bicycle; will you opt to circumnavigate it and add day(s) to the tour, or will you consent to be transported through it via pickup truck?  

I have enjoyed the 4 ACA routes I have ridden because their maps are designed to keep you on lesser traveled and lower traffic roads as much as they can.  While riding the Transam route, I met some cyclists going my way who analyzed the ACA route each day and would try to shorten it by riding busier highways that were more direct.  While they might shave 5-10 miles from a 60-mile day, they missed a lot of the rural scenery and small-town Americana that the route traversed.  Sometimes they cut out entire days by taking a more direct routing on busier roads to shorten a looped section, and I might not see them again for a week.  They weren't really riding the Transam - they were just sort of following it but having a much different experience.   I'm not saying that one of these approaches is "good" and the other is "bad," I'm just saying that their goals were different than mine.  Their goal was to ride coast-to-coast and sort-of follow the Transam but with as little effort as possible, and my goal was to experience the Transam.  

On the ACA Northern Tier route, there are lots of times that the ACA route will diverge from a busier highway and take a parallel route on lesser-traveled county roads that are more rural and scenic.  I would usually leave earlier than my riding partner, and I would follow the ACA routing.  He left later and would opt for the busier highway to save distance and time - so our experiences were different.  He missed some truly beautiful sections of the route.   As we got further west, the more he was "smelling the barn" and just trying to rush towards the finish.  Because of this, we split up at the Washington/Idaho border and he deadheaded to Seattle while I continued on to the western terminus of the Northern Tier in Anacortes.  Our goals were obviously different.  

I've met groups of cyclists traveling together who all rode together during the day.  Sometimes 1 of the group is acting as the Leader and is doing the navigating and the others are just following along.  In 1 such group of a half-dozen cyclists I met, one of the cyclists was unsure of the state (U.S. state, not state of mind) she was in - seriously - they had crossed the state line late yesterday afternoon in a hurry to reach their nightly destination and she was just head-down-and-pedal to follow the Leader.   For her, the whole trip was all about pedaling the bicycle and staying with the group - she wasn't navigating and it really didn't matter where she was as long as she stayed with the group.  So her goals would have been greatly incompatible with mine, as I at least like to know where I am and where I am headed.   I do occasionally get temporarily confused (okay, okay, I sometimes get lost), but successful cross-country navigation is part of my bike touring goals. 

Enough of my word-spew; the point is that everyone will benefit from an understanding of each other's goals before commencing a long tour together.  And if you haven't thought about what goals you may have, then that exercise alone can be quite worthwhile. 

*******

Wayne wrote; "I will eat lunch at a restaurant in cycling clothes, but dinners are always in "street" clothes. In fact I am often one of the best-dressed patrons."   Same here.  I usually wear long pants and a long-sleeve shirt to dinner.  My off-bike clothes are nylon fishing pants and shirt that can be rolled up very small for packing.  

Wayne wrote; "Buddy, your message wasn't long and detailed enough.  ;-)"   Okay then, I think this follow-up ought to do it.  :>) 

 

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1 year ago
Wayne EstesTo George Hall

Thanks! Elegantly detailed, anonymously vague.

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1 year ago
Andrea BrownTo George Hall

Not that I've ever taken a group tour, George, my only riding partner has been Bruce, that's plenty for me. But I love how you lay out your cycling ethics, and agree with all of them. One caveat: the treatment of hotel towels. Yes, drying off your bike before rolling it into a hotel room or hallway is preferable than leaving a muddy mess, but I'm pretty sure some small town motel will not appreciate having their towels muddied or ruined. Even worse are those who actually wipe down the oily parts of their bikes (chains, gears) with hotel towels. That's ridiculously rude and bound to impact their view of the next arriving cyclist. 

Bring your own rag towels, folks. Or pick up a discarded shirt by the roadside and use that, for pete's sake.

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1 year ago
Steve Miller/GrampiesTo Andrea Brown

One of our fondest memories is rolling up to a motel literally dripping water, from our bikes, our clothes, our noses, everywhere. The reception rushed about finding old towels and rags for us to stand on (bikes were outside) while we checked in, then offered us more old pieces of cloth to use on the bikes and reassured us that both we and the bikes could go into the room.

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1 year ago
George HallTo Andrea Brown

Andrea - I certainly agree - I'm careful to not use a hotel towel on any oily parts like the chain - those are used for bulk water drying of my panniers and fenders and handlebar bag. I keep a small shop rag in my handlebar bag for oily part handling.

But that brings up another point. I'm also careful exactly how and where I lean the bike in the hotel room. I don't lean the chain side against the bed for instance. These are just common-sense polite things that I think most of us do - and when we do, it makes the hotel more receptive to allowing future cyclists to bring their bikes inside.  Unfortunately, not everyone is so considerate.

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1 year ago